tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21444271.post501753087145424357..comments2023-11-03T22:34:56.656+09:00Comments on I'm no Picasso: The Grand Narrative and AMR: Hello. I'm a woman.I'm no Picassohttp://www.blogger.com/profile/06516337555349888808noreply@blogger.comBlogger21125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21444271.post-84622058269091659832010-10-02T06:22:19.722+09:002010-10-02T06:22:19.722+09:00Dunk, this may tax your credulity, since it appear...Dunk, this may tax your credulity, since it appears you're bent on believing what you wish to believe, but, in 2007, I met a 19 year old American from Kentucky who taught English in Korea.<br /><br />Wait for it... wait for it... GASP. You mean an individual with a GED who is old enough to vote, leave home, attend college, or even join the military to fight in Iraq or Afghanistan can teach English in a foreign country? No. Get over yourself.Korean-Americannoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21444271.post-48038250300934914272010-10-01T16:33:26.241+09:002010-10-01T16:33:26.241+09:00Korean-American, you seem to be telling me you thi...Korean-American, you seem to be telling me you think high school boys are taking jobs in South Korea teaching English.Dunkhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07690657118406528876noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21444271.post-42219194779617336032010-10-01T16:04:26.582+09:002010-10-01T16:04:26.582+09:00"No, you're right Dunk. The only problem ..."No, you're right Dunk. The only problem there is in the world is Chinese-American men referring to you as 'boy', "<br /><br />Oh yes. The point of my post is that someone personally calling me boy is the only problem in the world. My rejection of collective guilt and collective responsibi0lity is a canard disguising that. <br /><br />3 pages? - I'm a very fast typist, is all. Same stream-of-consciousness, more words on the screen...Dunkhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07690657118406528876noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21444271.post-88648555022603266092010-09-29T06:40:38.685+09:002010-09-29T06:40:38.685+09:00No, you're right Dunk. The only problem there ...No, you're right Dunk. The only problem there is in the world is Chinese-American men referring to you as 'boy', which you totally have the right to write a three page rant about. Everything else is over-exaggerated and a result of people making victims out of themselves. I don't know what we would do without people who have suffered such things as you have to set all the rest of us straight on this account. We'll all follow your example and just suck it up and deal with it from now on.I'm no Picassohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06516337555349888808noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21444271.post-59451732264553670752010-09-29T05:38:20.028+09:002010-09-29T05:38:20.028+09:00Just to clarify:
What I meant by "white boy&...Just to clarify:<br /><br />What I meant by "white boy" was just that - a white male under the age of 21. If you haven't reached majority, you are a boy/girl or teen or adolescent. To be sure, I refer to 19 year old Koreans as Korean/Asian boys sometimes. It was not my intention to have one read "boy" as code for some insult.<br /><br />Furthermore, the point of mentioning the "white boy" was to remind Koreans to consider the consequences of their actions before blaming innocent folks.<br /><br />Dunk, you misread what I wrote and labeled me a bigot in the process. You appear to be hypersensitive to cues of slight committed by others on the basis of color, ethnicity, or race. You know, such things actually occur, right? I daresay, a self-respecting person would acknowledge the reality and refuse to participate.Korean-Americannoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21444271.post-56644579256170963932010-09-29T00:18:10.977+09:002010-09-29T00:18:10.977+09:00Sorry, got my blogs mixed up a bit. Jake is a post...Sorry, got my blogs mixed up a bit. Jake is a poster in another forum spouting "the media hasn't been nice to us therefore I get a free pass to mouth any hateful nonsense about whites I want".Dunkhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07690657118406528876noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21444271.post-24350173576323646502010-09-29T00:00:30.398+09:002010-09-29T00:00:30.398+09:00No. I refuse to think of myself and other people ...No. I refuse to think of myself and other people as collective groups, "with perspective" as you say. It amounts to the thesis that a group of people were awful to another group of people in some other place and time, therefore certain individuals in the here and now get their behaviour and views privileged, get a different set of rules than everyone else. <br /><br />I reject that entirely and nothing anyone can say will make me accept it, so save your breath "before (you) get going". I reject group responsibility entirely. <br /><br />The media argument doesn't hold up to scrutiny, by the way. I see strong, capable intelligent Asian characters all over the media, from Law and Order to Lost to ER to Grey's Anatomy to every movie Jet Li has ever made to the woman who reads the news on my City news every night. Are they all over North American media, in every show? No. As 5-8% of the population, it's unreasonable to expect that.<br /><br />The beef seems to be that EVERY Asian male roll should be heroic, noble, and inspiring acknowledgement of the wonder that is Jake. That even one Long Dong Duc or whatever his name was in 16 Candles is evidence of horrible racism. Well get used to life because that is not going to happen and no group is above comedy. Every group gets its share of clown characters - you think Kevin James isn't ridiculous? Do I consider him an affront to my some bs theoretical concept of 'white manhood' ? Pshaw. Get over yourselves, Jakes of North America. <br /><br />I don't suffer discrimination for one minute, and my feelings are never hurt by people I don't respect, so put that snideness to bed. I refuse to shut up and allow it, and I hold everyone I meet to the same expectations of behavior with - start with me and you'll get it right back, that's the best policy. <br /><br />Anything else is a kind of weird "dhimmitude" of ethnicity, if you ask me. Why you buy into this concept when you have seen where it practically leads to (the original event related in your post)is beyond me.Dunkhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07690657118406528876noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21444271.post-8031543539385423002010-09-28T12:39:15.590+09:002010-09-28T12:39:15.590+09:00Dunk... no offense, but based on what you've r...Dunk... no offense, but based on what you've read here, I would really suggest not getting me started on exactly how much discrimination *white men* have suffered at the hands of other people expecting to be treated like and thought of as people. You haven't quite crossed that line, but you're definitely tap dancing on it. I'm sorry somebody once referred to you as "boy" and that hurt your feelings. But maybe you should stop and think about why a Chinese-American man might feel the need to occasionally make a small barb such as that. Maybe because the only time he ever sees himself mirrored in any kind of media image, it's as an accented, smelly, backwards, impotent, horny, small-dicked, athletically challenged, wok-yielding delivery boy. <br /><br />Does it excuse him referring to you as a boy in a possibly passive-aggressively demeaning manner? No. But a little perspective on your part might not go amiss.I'm no Picassohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06516337555349888808noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21444271.post-58231001037817251372010-09-28T12:31:53.606+09:002010-09-28T12:31:53.606+09:00"Koreans misplace their anger. They get upset..."Koreans misplace their anger. They get upset over the fact that a white boy from Kentucky "<br /><br />Digression:<br />One of the best ways to know you are talking to a black or white bigot is the word "boy".<br />It slips by the notice of most, but has anyone else ever noticed the frequency of white men being referred to as "boys" by non-white men? A bigoted Chinese-Canadian I worked with was in the habit of this, and I always made a point to work the word back into my answer, like 'Well, you Asian boys... etc etc' back to him - just to point out to him how demeaning, patronizing and bigoted it was. <br /><br />The key point in no-Picasso's post is her observation that what Asian men who hold these views are actually angling for is for all to acknowledge their superiority. All this talk of colonialism/racism/blah blah is just a tool, a word club trying to make those stubborn inferiors BOW DOWN TO ME ALREADY!Dunkhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07690657118406528876noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21444271.post-44259059058877612912010-09-20T11:16:28.700+09:002010-09-20T11:16:28.700+09:00gwern: dammit you beat me to "Poe's Law&q...gwern: dammit you beat me to "Poe's Law" - that "Without a smiley or other sign to ignorate humor, it is impossible to differentiate a parody of fundamentalism that someone won't mistake for the real thing"<br /><br />my favorite example: "Gimme That Christian Side Hug"<br />http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m_Oj0-splZwRoboseyohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06308196436612993379noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21444271.post-23371309311015894942010-09-18T12:43:54.359+09:002010-09-18T12:43:54.359+09:00Won - Sorry, just for clarification. When discussi...Won - Sorry, just for clarification. When discussing racial separatism and "Korea" -- your use of the word "Korea" refers to "North Korea," right?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21444271.post-85925135305166507902010-09-18T11:51:57.750+09:002010-09-18T11:51:57.750+09:00Well, he many not have realized how much that bit ...Well, he many not have realized how much that bit about reducing the number of foreigners in South Korea may have hit home, given how we constantly hear flutterings of that variety (whether based on genuine public opinion or not) out of the press and many other sources here. He did basically take part of what Jake actually said and carry it to an extreme. But I think the website he links to, which is quite extraordinary, makes a bit of a point for him.I'm no Picassohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06516337555349888808noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21444271.post-84460045203944584272010-09-18T11:45:02.303+09:002010-09-18T11:45:02.303+09:00I sure hope he was. I would point out that Poe'...I sure hope he was. I would point out that Poe's law (http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Poe%27s_Law) is as operational for racists as it is for creationists.gwernhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18349479103216755952noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21444271.post-7763071982930046212010-09-18T11:40:37.065+09:002010-09-18T11:40:37.065+09:00Anon -- I believe Won was being just a tad tongue-...Anon -- I believe Won was being just a tad tongue-in-cheek.I'm no Picassohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06516337555349888808noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21444271.post-42893190408672653852010-09-18T08:21:13.546+09:002010-09-18T08:21:13.546+09:00Won- The segregation you call for in the SK and A...Won- The segregation you call for in the SK and America sounds racist to me and undoubtably many others.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21444271.post-11697184540511749102010-09-18T07:26:44.044+09:002010-09-18T07:26:44.044+09:00Won -- While your idea is not a bad one, I have to...Won -- While your idea is not a bad one, I have to say that it may not entirely align with Jake's. While he seems to be quite understanding of the need for Asian women to be protected from white men, due to their inherently vulnerable position of child-like stupidity, just one quick glance at his site will make it clear that he's quite in favor of being able, as an Asian male, to have a white woman draped around his neck like an accessory. <br /><br />Furthermore, as far as the harmful relationship between whites and Koreans in South Korea, it's important to remember that part of being a white woman in Korea is having to quickly climb out of a taxi late at night once you get in and the driver (who is a man you are now alone in a car with) asks you if you are from Russia (ie, if you are a prostitute), and suggests that perhaps you would like to make a stop by a love motel. When you get out of that car late at night, you may then have to walk down a street past drunk men who call out all kinds of lecherous comments in your direction, while also at times trying to physically touch you or follow you home. They do this because of television shows such as Misuda (Chatting With Beauties) where they've been taught that white women living in South Korea are not only cute and stupid, but also fawn over the idea of Korean men while denigrating white men as obvious sexual predators. <br /><br />All of this is part of a necessary process in which women of both races can be successfully put in their places, so that Asian men may reclaim their superior position. White men in America have been able to be superior, condescending and objectifying toward women for as long as anyone can remember. Asian men must fight for the same rights, if they are to be considered equals, in their own minds. Therefore, a certain amount of mixing is necessary. But only in the specific ways that Jake defines it.I'm no Picassohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06516337555349888808noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21444271.post-33542888257230868172010-09-18T03:14:27.204+09:002010-09-18T03:14:27.204+09:00You cannot agree with Jakes' points and still ...You cannot agree with Jakes' points and still say that this issue is restricted to the feelings of individuals. Relationships between Koreans and whites, "friendships" or otherwise, are inherently oppressive, since they are founded on unequal positions, as Jake explained. This goes beyond what whites may feel, or think they feel as individuals. There is simply no way a white/Korean relationship can avoid being harmful to the Korean side. Suggesting that any Korean would honestly want to enter in to such a relationship is the height of racism.<br /><br />If the South Korean government was really concerned with the well-being of its citizens, it would make mixed relationships illegal and drastically restrict the number of foreigners allowed to live there. This would allow far less opportunity for confused Koreans to get into destructive situations. There is quite a lot of public support for such measures already.<br /><br />This should also apply to Koreans living in america. The best possible thing would be for them to form their own institutions within their communities, particularly schools. This will help to reduce mixing as well as exploitation by whites.<br /><br />The fundamental issue is this: Koreans should _not_ be lovers with whites. They should _not_ be friends with whites. Ideally, they should have as few relations with whites as possible. Koreans dating whites should end their relationships. Koreans married to whites should divorce them. Moreover, they should end any so-called friendships they have with whites. This is the only way for them to stop being exploited and oppressed.Wonhttp://www.thefighting44s.com/noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21444271.post-24275703039670959992010-09-17T11:53:33.046+09:002010-09-17T11:53:33.046+09:00Whenever the subject come up--which thankfully is ...Whenever the subject come up--which thankfully is quite rarely--I'll acknowledge that yes my Korean wife and I are a mixed couple: I'm Methodist and she's Presbyterian.The Sanity Inspectorhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04808433661634318393noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21444271.post-63542516094616437652010-09-15T21:36:32.365+09:002010-09-15T21:36:32.365+09:00This is a very well written argument. Anyone who s...This is a very well written argument. Anyone who sides with 'what's-his-face' needs to think twice.<br /><br />Also, I can't help but agree with ananymous, clearly he's experienced one too many rejections.Jimmyhttp://strange-lands.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21444271.post-72058997160744093942010-09-15T04:51:58.353+09:002010-09-15T04:51:58.353+09:00> "Oh nothing. Call me conservative or wha...> "Oh nothing. Call me conservative or whatever, but I still feel uncomfortable when I see a white guy with a Korean girl."<br /><br />It seems to me that this fellow's problem is attempting to come up with rationalizations for this gut feeling. If he had simply stopped there, there's nothing to end the relation over.<br /><br />It would be as if he had said he feels uncomfortable when seeing spiders and feels an urge to smash them flat, although objectively he ought to like spiders because they eat all the insects that bug him.<br /><br />The take-away lesson, I think, is to not lie to yourself & everyone else by pretending that every emotion/belief/thought is 100% correct and justified. Most aren't.gwernhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18349479103216755952noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21444271.post-1060096649437175102010-09-14T23:06:03.874+09:002010-09-14T23:06:03.874+09:00I agree with you wholeheartedly. I love my girlfr...I agree with you wholeheartedly. I love my girlfriend...not because she's Korean...nor in spite of it. I love her because of who she is. She loves me very much the same way. It has nothing to do with skin colour. Nothing at all. I don't have 'yellow fever' or any of the other semi-retarded frat boy terms. She isn't some self esteemless 'banana' yellow on the inside but white on the inside. We're just two people who like each other. Why is that so fucking difficult for some fucktards to understand?Burndoghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10810891417843137002noreply@blogger.com