tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21444271.post6059926760156186656..comments2023-11-03T22:34:56.656+09:00Comments on I'm no Picasso: On the corporal punishment ban.I'm no Picassohttp://www.blogger.com/profile/06516337555349888808noreply@blogger.comBlogger37125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21444271.post-4999985671983656222011-06-11T08:45:35.029+09:002011-06-11T08:45:35.029+09:00I'm well aware of that. This is one of the few...I'm well aware of that. This is one of the few things I mostly just refuse to argue with people about. Because, in my opinion, people (especially Americans) are highly irrational and reactionary about it. Especially if they don't have any first hand experience. But to me, it's one of those things that you don't get to have a stronger opinion about when you don't know anything about it, so I mostly just ignore it. People who quote data from their child psych books in my face in an attempt to argue with me about the way I was raised just aren't going to get anywhere with me, so it's not even worth the effort of responding most of the time. They can have their opinion and insist that it's fact, but at the end of the day, it's still just their opinion. Which is fine.I'm no Picassohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06516337555349888808noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21444271.post-90753290163380105012011-06-11T03:37:47.740+09:002011-06-11T03:37:47.740+09:00I'm not trying to stir up the commentariat aga...I'm not trying to stir up the commentariat again, but did you see today's post on You Are Not So Smart? It's about the Backfire Effect. I think it explains why neither side to this argument will ever get anywhere with the other side (and it does touch on spanking, but only very briefly). It's just kind of timely. Really not trying to stir up shi!t, I promise.JLRhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10388373123232297147noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21444271.post-78175983520642666082011-05-25T06:49:18.859+09:002011-05-25T06:49:18.859+09:00And just for the record...
The censorship has not...And just for the record...<br /><br />The censorship has nothing to do with TK being my "friend". I'm quite sure he can take care of himself, and I'm even more sure that your comment probably didn't even bother him in the first place. Because it wasn't true. <br /><br />What it does have to do with is the fact that my boyfriend, my coworkers, a large percentage of my friends and all of my students are ESL speakers. I am an ESL teacher. Attacking someone based on their ESL speaker status, be it "racist" or just fucking ugly, is not something I can imagine you would think I would actually allow to happen on this blog.I'm no Picassohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06516337555349888808noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21444271.post-9682805732033837792011-05-25T06:19:30.840+09:002011-05-25T06:19:30.840+09:00TIMP -- You attacked TK's English out of anger...TIMP -- You attacked TK's English out of anger, without there actually being an issue with his English. You brought it up out of nowhere just to be nasty and ugly and just to condescend. I don't care what your fucking background is. If you think that you being a second language speaker makes it better, then it's just more proof of your issues with logic -- you have absolutely no excuse not to know better. <br /><br />All I did was make a comparative statement. If you think someone thinking someone else's grasp of English is better than yours is racist, then so be it. But I suggest not being the first one to bring the subject up in the future if it offends you. When you start on a line of conversation, other people are bound to follow it.I'm no Picassohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06516337555349888808noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21444271.post-43166413378885000142011-05-25T04:06:22.424+09:002011-05-25T04:06:22.424+09:00Hey INP,
After my last posts I decided to wait a ...Hey INP,<br /><br />After my last posts I decided to wait a bit until I wasn't so heated before coming back to see what The Korean would have to say and found your censors.<br /><br />It's your blog, you can do as you wish.<br /><br />I just wanted to say that as a second language speaker myself (I didn't go to an English school until I was in high school), I didn't know that attacking The Korean's incorrect assessments of my posts was beyond reproach. He attacked my English, I attacked his. No big deal. <br /><br />From my experience, when you blog 95% of the time in English, identify yourself as "Korean-<i>American</i>" and live in the USA since the age of 16, there's a certain statute of limitations in calling oneself a "second language speaker" which is why I don't go around saying I'm a second language speaker even though I've only been using English as my primary language for the past 15 years.<br /><br />I shall heed your warning and contemplate how attacking the English of a second language speaker is, apparently, racist and chalk up your outburst against me as a moment of bad judgment and not as a racist act. You felt the need to defend a friend, as wrong as he was, and I can respect that.<br /><br />I apologize for the troubles I've caused on your blog.This Is Me Postinghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09030020860151702543noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21444271.post-59536865045123199842011-05-19T19:50:24.316+09:002011-05-19T19:50:24.316+09:00MeganMc -- Thank you for sharing all of that. The ...MeganMc -- Thank you for sharing all of that. The one place where I do take a stand for taking CP out of the schools is in the sense that teachers are, after all, human beings. And they make mistakes. And, in my opinion, a mistake with CP <i>is</i> worse than a mistake with other kinds of punishment.I'm no Picassohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06516337555349888808noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21444271.post-42789363631771000262011-05-19T19:44:50.325+09:002011-05-19T19:44:50.325+09:00And by being that lazy and afraid themselves of th...And by being that lazy and afraid themselves of the popular kids, they inadvertently gave them real power over the rest of the class. Those bullies had most of the class under their thumb because everyone knew the teacher was on their side and if you crossed them, the teachers would use CP on you, not them. <br /><br /> The CP didn’t scar me, but the injustice of it did. While they didn’t abuse us, they did abuse the use of CP in my opinion. <br /><br /> Yet is there a better solution? The kids will still be punished regardless. <br /><br /> I don’t know Korea’s system well enough to say if it compares easily to America, but from what I’ve heard it does sound very similar to Japan’s. In Japan, they got rid of CP a long time ago and in the good schools this causes no problem, but in the bad ones it’s made a bad problem far worse.<br /><br /> In those places, the kids are sometimes out of control. They openly bully the kids and sometimes even the ALTs. The worst punishment they might get is a good yelling at from the principal. They simply stand there, heads down, going “Hai” the entire time and when it’s over they leave and go and do it again. They don’t care. From their perspective they can do whatever they want, it’s not like their heading anywhere in life. They’re already regarded as “heading for the dregs of society” and don’t see how they can make it any worse by being bastards to those around them.<br /><br /> In one severe incident that got passed through the ALT channels there was an ALT who was being tortured by one of his JHS students. The worst incident happened when he was biking home one day and this kid came running at him, throwing rocks. He managed to get away unharmed, but when he came to school the next day to report it, the school did the usual “yell at the student” and then ask the ALT to forgive him. Forgive him for “rocks”? <br /><br /> The ALT had to change his pattern and keep a watch out, but even then it didn’t stop this JHS kid from trying to push him down a flight of stairs. (He believed the kid was mentally unstable and all the teachers did so as well.) Nobody would do anything. <br /><br /> Explaining didn’t have any effect on this child, but that was all the adults were willing to do against him. This very kid even seriously beat another kid, breaking one of the other child’s ribs, and all the school did was ask the “beaten” child’s parents to please keep hushed about it. The bully was never ex pulsed or anything. They don’t do that here in Japan, not in JHS.<br /><br /> And demerits and detention are out of the question since those would interfere with club activities. <br /><br /> I saw a previous poster on this forum mention that if he was hit, he would hit back. I wonder, if a student hits a teacher, throws rocks at him, tries to push him down a flight of stairs, does the teacher have the right to do those things back?MeganMchttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00173248549158885833noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21444271.post-43907939447363094972011-05-19T19:44:10.178+09:002011-05-19T19:44:10.178+09:00Another great post. I’m going to chime in with m...Another great post. I’m going to chime in with my own opinion on CP and this comes from my own experiences. When I was young my parents sent me to a private school. At this school they used CP. <br /><br /> It was used on or before me for two separate occasions: one with a ruler being swatted against my palms and another with me being forced to eat soap. The worst punishment, “paddling”, was never used on me, but it was used on my friend. He was sent to the principal’s office and when he came back he was red-faced from crying. <br /><br /> The swatting was because I said the teacher was wrong to punish my friend since the “bullies” in our class had provoked him. The teacher punished me and him for questioning an “elder”. <br /><br /> The second case, the “paddling”, was because the kids, her “darlings”, had picked on my friend until he finally snapped and shoved one of them down. I said nothing that time. I remember his look of sadness at being so alone and I was too scared to say anything since I knew the teacher would never take our side against her “favorites”. <br /><br /> The “soap” incident happened in the first grade when a boy (different from the other bullies but no less of one himself) repeatedly insulted me until I fired back at him, “Go to hell”. When I lost it, he grinned ear to ear. It was what he had been wanting the whole time. He quickly rushed to teacher and told her what I said. She took me to the bathroom and made me eat soap. <br /><br /> In all three cases, it was not the CP (done to me or to my friend) that caused me resentment. It was WHY they were done. CP was used on us because we were “weaker”. We were not as popular as the other kids and didn’t cause trouble the way the other kids could. The teacher was afraid to get the ire of her “darlings” so she chose to take their side and make an example of us. Neither teacher bothered to really investigate what was actually going on and who was actually being victimized. They couldn’t take the time for that.MeganMchttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00173248549158885833noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21444271.post-91938852524777025082011-05-19T16:58:31.213+09:002011-05-19T16:58:31.213+09:00*now censoring.*now censoring.I'm no Picassohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06516337555349888808noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21444271.post-21375881079939500882011-05-19T16:57:53.610+09:002011-05-19T16:57:53.610+09:00TIMP -- Since you have now crossed the line from n...TIMP -- Since you have now crossed the line from nonsensical rambling on over into being racist and condescending to a second language speaker, as the owner of the blog, I am not censoring. I won't tolerate that for one fucking second. <br /><br />And for the record, TK seems to understand the English language a hell of a lot better than you do. As well as logic in general. And he is a second language speaker. So maybe you should take some time to think about that.I'm no Picassohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06516337555349888808noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21444271.post-60461183930561411072011-05-19T15:19:25.793+09:002011-05-19T15:19:25.793+09:00This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.This Is Me Postinghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09030020860151702543noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21444271.post-66372710097108037032011-05-19T10:58:55.886+09:002011-05-19T10:58:55.886+09:00Sigh. Do I really have to explain to you what your...Sigh. Do I really have to explain to you what your words mean? Here is what you wrote:<br /><br />"You start using weapons (i.e. "love sticks") to beat people, <b>pretty soon</b>, one of these kids will have enough and realize that he or she can (and SHOULD) fight back and start escalating. They'll get sick of it and <b>bring their own sticks. Or knives.</b>"<br /><br />You did not just say a student in Korea would fight back in retaliation to corporal punishment. You had additional requirements, including temporal requirement ("pretty soon") and manner of retaliation (with "sticks or knives"). Furthermore, your temporal requirement states that many such cases should have already happened. So this is what I said: "By your account, by 1980s there should have been a mass armed revolt by students all over Korea." That is the thing that "never happened." <br /><br />Or is this another "embellishment" that I was supposed to disregard, and attempt to read your mind instead?T.K. (Ask a Korean!)https://www.blogger.com/profile/07663422474464557214noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21444271.post-86208628503605564412011-05-19T10:49:53.501+09:002011-05-19T10:49:53.501+09:00The problem with what you're arguing is that i...The problem with what you're arguing is that it sounds like, essentially, you think all discipline is mean. Whether it be a slap to the palms or a week of detention, the students must be held accountable for following the rules. Which means that their will will have to bend to the teachers' wills. So I don't understand the whole argument about holding them down and cutting their hair, or them not being allowed to hit back. A student is also not allowed to give a teacher detention, or make a teacher stand outside the school gate holding a sign. Why? Because that would be ridiculous. Maybe you think students should not be punished, or should be able to retaliate however they choose when they are punished. I don't agree. I believe that strong discipline is essential to building good, strong character in people. <br /><br />Again, with the emotionlessness, obviously I did not mean that the teacher is an intellectual void while he is disciplining. He is not, however, angry. He is not in a rage. He is not trying to hurt the students because he has a personal motivation. Just like any punishment carried out for the sake of personal revenge is wrong, so too is hitting a child in anger. But a punishment that is clearly defined and outlined for the students, and carried out in a rational mind is not something that I have a problem with. Not when it is only a slap on the palm. <br /><br />Again, if you don't get these points, then I don't know what to say. I don't really feel comfortable with your system of logic, given that you've already stereotyped both Americans and Koreans quite cruelly. To be frank, I'd rather be slapped on the palm then be classified as someone who "loves it" when children bring guns to school, or whose spirit is broken. So we'll agree to disagree.I'm no Picassohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06516337555349888808noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21444271.post-52822176869846879152011-05-19T09:57:00.645+09:002011-05-19T09:57:00.645+09:00Oh! I'm sorry, I forgot to say thank you for t...Oh! I'm sorry, I forgot to say thank you for taking the time to repost my posts. That was very nice of you.This Is Me Postinghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09030020860151702543noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21444271.post-81827749432402495152011-05-19T09:55:50.283+09:002011-05-19T09:55:50.283+09:00@INP - I've already apologized about "shi...@INP - I've already apologized about "shit kicking." Twice. I already said I see your point and I've already said that I shouldn't have embellished.<br /><br />As for hitting on the palms and being unemotional: Once again, I don't think anyone does anything against another human without emotion. I don't want to stipulate on his motivations here, because I have a feeling you'll take me quite literally, but I simply can't believe that he feels absolutely nothing at all while he's doing it: whether it be anger, excitement, remorse, perverse pleasure, shame, hatred, annoyance, pity, I don't care. It could be anything. But I just can't accept that people do something to other people without emotion. Furthermore, once again, it's easy for the teacher to hit these kids on the palms because he knows these kids won't hit back or defend themselves. How many kids did he hit? How hard? Now for each kid that he hit, imagine that that kid could hit his palm back. How many times a year does he hit any one particular kid? How does a kid feel after the 5th, 6th time he gets hit? Over what? A hair cut? Maybe because mom and dad are too busy working late nights and the kid can't drive himself to the barbershop? He gets a hit for that? That seems totally fair. What would happen if a kid refused to let himself be hit? What would happen if he pulled his hand away or pushed his teacher away? What would happen if the kid let his hair grow out anyway? Are they going to then strap him down and forcibly cut his hair?<br /><br />Sigh. Okay, we'll end here, 'cause we're going around in circles. We won't agree to disagree though, as we're not debating the same issue and I'm tired of repeating myself. You're more than welcome to defend hitting kids who can't retaliate or defend themselves. I will continue to maintain that if someone is allowed to hit you, you should be allowed to defend yourself or retaliate. One should never be cowed into victimhood.<br /><br />As for your last part: Interesting. I see where you're going with this. Although, let's be fair here: I also said that it could possibly be apathy. Or that they're simply too tired from excessive work (because kids never fall asleep in class due to overwork, right). Or possibly because they know the law would rule against them should they ever try to retaliate.<br /><br />I mean, I gave a couple of scenarios in that post. I was, of course, speaking hypothetically and what's the word again... guessing. Interesting that you're only cherry picking those two points.This Is Me Postinghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09030020860151702543noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21444271.post-28014505357780420162011-05-19T09:09:16.458+09:002011-05-19T09:09:16.458+09:00TIMP: Kicking the shit out of someone is quite a l...TIMP: Kicking the shit out of someone is quite a literal statement to me. And, even taken figuratively, I fail to see how a singular smack across the palms is an equivalent. Also, to address your statement about emotionlessness on the part of the administrator, that PE teacher who took care of hair cut inspection yesterday had to check literally every student in the school. He gave out hundreds of smacks. I can assure you that he was not in a rage for the entire day. It was just routine, and he wasn't even acting angry. He ribbed the students a bit about not doing what they should have done, gave them all a smack, tussled their hair, and sent them back to class. <br /><br />If your stance is that you believe that ever putting your hands on a child in punishment, no matter how little harm or pain you may cause, is wrong, then that's your opinion. And I can't argue with an opinion, so I would have to just agree to disagree. But I will not agree that a smack on the palm is the same as kicking the shit out of someone. That's just simply a very literal logical misstatement. <br /><br />And you are right -- you didn't say your students. But I assume your students have never hauled off and hit a teacher, or shown up to school with a knife. I also assume your students have, at least at some point, been subject to corporal punishment. Your assessment of the situation is that students who undergo corporal punishment have only refrained from hitting teachers and carrying knives because their spirits are broken. Therefore, the logical conclusion is that your students must have broken spirits, in your opinion. It's just a matter of applying what you've actually said, logically.I'm no Picassohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06516337555349888808noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21444271.post-9868111997065173282011-05-19T09:02:12.910+09:002011-05-19T09:02:12.910+09:00This Is Me Posting has left a new comment on your ...This Is Me Posting has left a new comment on your post "On the corporal punishment ban.":<br /><br />1) I did say that and I stand by it. Please except my humblest apologies for not elaborating on "shit kicked out of you." I can see why you thought I was being extreme, I forgot that this isn't the internet and figures of speech and embellishments are never used online.<br /><br />That being said, one's definition of "shit kicked out of you" is, once again, simply an argument of barometer. But again, my apologies.<br /><br />2) The post was there. I read it on your blog after I posted it. I even reloaded the page to see your post after mine. After my response to you, the post was gone.<br /><br />If you're saying that you didn't delete it though, I'll take you at your word and pull it up from my cache ('cause I definitely don't feel like retyping all that I wrote) and blame the whole thing on internet goblins.<br /><br />3) If you can do me a favour, could you tell me exactly where I said that my students had broken spirits and suffered from SS? I'm looking over what I wrote and I can't seem to find it.<br /><br />Believe me, I understand the importance of writing carefully and of making assumptions. I've apparently mislead you once with the whole "shit kicking" thing, I would hate to think I somehow mislead you again.I'm no Picassohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06516337555349888808noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21444271.post-52548726813256898852011-05-19T09:01:41.718+09:002011-05-19T09:01:41.718+09:00This Is Me Posting has left a new comment on your ...This Is Me Posting has left a new comment on your post "On the corporal punishment ban.":<br /><br />@The Korean - Oh for crying out loud. I did answer your question. My mistake was I didn't Google shit for you 'cause I know Googling is hard: http://www.koreatimes.co.kr/www/news/nation/2009/06/117_47481.html<br /><br />Is 2009 recent enough for something like this to have - hold on, hold on, let me quote you here so I get this right - "never happened?"<br /><br />Student is hit with book, she slapped back, she gets beaten to such a point she received 12 weeks of medical treatment AND lost her court case. So, not only do I make a mockery of your "never happened" and the rest of your pathetically sanctimonious Ad Ignorantium fallacy, I proved every single one of my conjectures correct.<br /><br />Tell me again how I'm back peddling. And tell me again how this "never happens" in Korea, please. PLEASE. I'd like to laugh at your posts more. Also, tell me again how my points aren't worth addressing because my framework is crazy and nothing I say would ever happen like that. Especially not in Great Nation Korea.<br /><br />So, once again for those that have a little trouble with this: MY stance is that everyone should be allowed to defend themselves. The Korean's stance is that this would never happen in Korea, nor has it happened, nor will it ever happen. The REALITY is that it's happened as recently as 2009 and a LEGAL COURT in Korea ruled that... wait wait, let me quote this article from a newspapaer in Korea: "Retaliating to Corporal Punishment Is Not Self-Defense," thereby making self-defence an illegal act.<br /><br />You know what sucks about not being able to defend yourself, Mr. Korean? You become a victim and things start to look desperate. Maybe Korean kids haven't retaliated as much as I figured they would. Maybe they just internalize it or hurt themselves. Or others. Nah, of course not. This is Great Nation Korea. That would never happen either. Right(http://www.koreatimes.co.kr/www/news/nation/2009/05/113_44229.html)? Right(http://pediatrics.aappublications.org/content/115/2/357.abstract)? But I'm sure you're going to tell me with your awesome knowledge of everything Korea that suicide never happens in Korea too, so forget I said anything.<br /><br />I think we're done here, Mr. Korean. It's been uninspiring.I'm no Picassohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06516337555349888808noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21444271.post-50133990518274768942011-05-19T09:01:03.096+09:002011-05-19T09:01:03.096+09:00This is me posting -- for some reason, Blogger doe...This is me posting -- for some reason, Blogger does seem to be deleting your comments. I have no idea why, and I assure you it is not me who is doing it. So I'll repost them now, as I have them in my inbox.I'm no Picassohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06516337555349888808noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21444271.post-11041952321157236652011-05-19T08:32:10.847+09:002011-05-19T08:32:10.847+09:00First of all, you're the one who said, and I q...First of all, you're the one who said, and I quote: "But that consequence was NEVER getting the shit kicked out of me; which is what CP is, bar none."<br /><br />I simply gave you an example of that being a complete falsity. Which you've agreed with. So I'm glad that at least now you're willing to admit that not all CP is kids having the shit kicked out of them. That's a step in the right direction toward being somewhat rational on this subject. <br /><br />Secondly, I have not censored anything. My blog comments are not on moderation. Whatever you post will show up the second you post it. If you cocked up posting a comment, that has nothing to do with me. I have no reason to censor you. I think it's quite self-evident to everyone that you're not making a lot of sense anyway, so I'm not worried about what you have to say. Say whatever you'd like. <br /><br />Thirdly, I didn't make any assumptions about you but, once again, just repeated what you said back to you. You said your students have broken spirits and suffer from SS. I did not say that. I just highlighted the fact that you did. If you would like for me to just ignore what you're saying and assume that you don't actually mean it, then that can be arranged. Otherwise, you should speak more carefully.I'm no Picassohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06516337555349888808noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21444271.post-37790906622614528532011-05-19T07:51:18.324+09:002011-05-19T07:51:18.324+09:00Wow. Censored my counter to Mr. Korean with all my...Wow. Censored my counter to Mr. Korean with all my links. Cool.<br /><br />Well, it's your blog. You're more than welcome to delete whatever you'd like.This Is Me Postinghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09030020860151702543noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21444271.post-78250856216975943842011-05-19T07:44:59.143+09:002011-05-19T07:44:59.143+09:00@INP - Cool. So now we're arguing a barometer ...@INP - Cool. So now we're arguing a barometer of "How much pain is okay?" I get it! Kinda like those people who say: "Okay, well, just how far do you have to go before it's considered sexual assault?" Right?<br /><br />Once again: A victim is a victim because that person is powerless. Each of those students should have had the right to hit that teacher back or defend themselves. <b>Period</b>.<br /><br />Yes, what he did is CP. No, they didn't have "the shit kicked out of them." (I mostly use that for dramatic effect and 'cause it's one end of the spectrum). But it only took one hit on the hand of my student for the teacher to have accidentally broken it. And that's my point. You can't hit a person and not expect some sort of consequence; whether it be physical, emotional, mental, long term or short term. I can't believe I'm legitimately having this conversation with people in 2011.<br /><br />Like I said, I broke rules, both at my school and with my parents. No one had to resort to physical violence. And now, look at me: I'm the ONLY one here that apparently has a problem with hitting kids. Forgive me if I feel I'm the one stuck in the room with crazy people. What kind of world are we in where I'm the lone voice <i>against</i> people hitting defenceless kids?<br /><br />Also, you are free to assume whatever you'd like about me. It doesn't make you (or your assumptions) any more right.This Is Me Postinghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09030020860151702543noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21444271.post-16768654577432383432011-05-19T06:38:35.495+09:002011-05-19T06:38:35.495+09:00Look -- if you want to continue to assert that all...Look -- if you want to continue to assert that all corporal punishment is kids getting the shit kicked out of them, then I don't know what to say to you. My students got their hair cuts checked yesterday. Everyone out of code stood out in the hall and held out their hands while the PE teacher went down the line and give each one smack across the palm. That is corporal punishment. How else would you define it? It is also, clearly, not students having the shit kicked out of them. If you're not able to distinguish the difference, then I have very little hope of explaining anything else to you. <br /><br />But, as a side note, I feel really bad for your students in Korea since you've decided that their entire lifestyle is apparently pathetic -- that they have broken spirits and suffer from SS. My students certainly are or do nothing of the sort. And I imagine they would be quite offended if they thought I believed that.I'm no Picassohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06516337555349888808noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21444271.post-90360133974601941522011-05-19T04:23:24.601+09:002011-05-19T04:23:24.601+09:00And one point about this:
I'm noticing EVERYO...And one point about this:<br /><br /><i><b>I'm noticing EVERYONE here is pusillanimously avoiding whilst attempting to discredit my argument with nescient dismissals. IF YOU HIT SOMEONE, THEY SHOULD HAVE THE RIGHT TO HIT YOU BACK. People have a RIGHT to defend themselves.</b></i><br /><br />I am not dealing with this "argument" -- and I suspect others are doing the same -- because this is actually not an argument at all. It is a naked assertion of your own beliefs. It is functionally equivalent to "I like chocolate ice cream." There is no point addressing it.<br /><br />As I see it, the only thing you gave that is NOT a naked assertion of your own value is your proposition that if CP were widespread, students will "pretty soon" fight back with sticks and knives. And noted above, such fighting back never happened, and you cannot explain why it never happened.T.K. (Ask a Korean!)https://www.blogger.com/profile/07663422474464557214noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21444271.post-46616140669419317342011-05-19T04:07:29.979+09:002011-05-19T04:07:29.979+09:00Buddy, I am working within the framework that YOU ...Buddy, I am working within the framework that YOU set up. You essentially said, "Korea should not be doing X, because the bad thing Y will happen." So I replied: "Korea has been doing X this whole time, but Y never happened. Why is that?" If your framework is correct, you ought to have a ready answer for my reply. But you don't. Instead, you give a litany of wild conjectures about how Korea does not operate the way you expect it to, and backpedal out of your own reasoning. Hmm.<br /><br />If you want to convince anybody that you are trying to make a rational argument instead of making a bald claim of cultural superiority, the least you can do is to follow <b>your own reason</b> why your proposition is true. Why would anyone take you seriously if you cannot even follow your own reasoning?T.K. (Ask a Korean!)https://www.blogger.com/profile/07663422474464557214noreply@blogger.com